Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

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Sara
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Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Sara » Sun Jan 28, 2018 10:49 am

Heh, where do I even start. Not sure if this even fits in 'General shuushuu stuff', and I can already see the 'you should have messaged admin' replies, so to settle that first - no, not messaging the "active" admin. Because it is very clear to me (and many other users, who I won't name for obvious reasons) that she plays the biggest part in mod mafia happening here (yeah, as funny as it sounds) and we all know whose side she will take here. So, no thanks.

I think it's already pretty obvious that I have many....disagreements with moderator I'm bringing up here, and I did try to be more understanding and positive when it comes to him. But sorry not sorry, can't be quiet about this.
I had a chance to prove many things happening before if I just took screenshots, and I've learnt my lesson. So, what I screenshoted, just from his posts today:

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Just look at that improvement

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I have many screenshots from other days, but I think this already says enough. Not to forget, I did ask him once, and here's what I got as a response:
http://e-shuushuu.net/image/944203/
aka 'It's pain, I'm lazy, It's easier this way etc' Nice.
Another beautiful example of how fair our moderators are:
http://e-shuushuu.net/image/700306/

Well, that's about it. :D I can even see me getting banned for this, given how "fair" this site is. But that's alright, thank for confirming my 'mod mafia on e-shuushuu' theory if you do! And no jokes, please, the 'mods don't make mistakes' "joke" is not funny, was never funny and will never be funny. Thank you!

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Gally
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Gally » Sun Jan 28, 2018 11:14 am

Well... I'm going to use this opportunity to voice that this is something that's come to my attention numerous times as well, and I'm interested in hearing a proper reason for why it keeps happening. To be frank, I don't see how Ran's excuse in the linked comment thread is reasonable in any way.

I've uploaded from my phone as well and I know how much of a pain it makes tagging, yet I never thought it was enough of a reason to break one of the board's rules "to save myself the frustration". If the rules are to be taken seriously, mods shouldn't be breaking any of them, don't you agree?

I understand that it happens to sometimes accidentally post before tagging, but that's obviously not the case for any of these posts, since Ran himself has admitted that he tags after uploading, for his own convenience. Please, enlighten me how that is fair to users who've gotten chewed out for slipping up once or twice.

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Fawn
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Fawn » Sun Jan 28, 2018 11:23 am

i upload from my phone only and this is why im not a regular uploader other than pixiv issues xDDD i was told "technical issues are forgivable" but it isn't really right or fair people do this by choice and get away with it. people went ham on me when i uploaded then tagged and they were mistakes.
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RockRabbit
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by RockRabbit » Sun Jan 28, 2018 2:44 pm

not gonna lie, i agree that this sort of behavior is problematic.
being part of the staff should be to help users, not to reap benefits, be it even something as small as making a snarky remark that you should always tag your stuff before uploading.
i think it would be fair to either change the rule so everyone has the ability to tag their image after uploading for at least 5-10 minutes, without getting chewed on, or penalize everyone for it, mods and taggers included.
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Sara
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Sara » Sun Jan 28, 2018 2:58 pm

RockRabbit wrote:i think it would be fair to either change the rule so everyone has the ability to tag their image after uploading for at least 5-10 minutes, without getting chewed on
Not sure do I agree with this part of your reply. To me this is like changing the rule because of one person, and 'tag before uploading' rule is one of the better rules we have, making the board somewhat organised.

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Ran
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Ran » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:01 pm

First off, allow me to direct you to the Shuu traditions page.

http://e-shuushuu.net/wiki/index.php/E- ... traditions

Specifically: Users are expected to tag their images when uploading or within a couple minutes.

I highly recommend being familiar with the rules and traditions before trying to call someone out on them. Also considering how I tag every individual upload immediately after uploading it unless some bizarre circumstance occurs, then I can't help but feel that you have some other issues going on if the 30 seconds regarding my tagging bothers you.

Next, don't call out the administrative and moderation team. We're here to help. If you have specific grievances with a person please address them directly. I'm not above talking about these issues should they arise, but please approach me personally. The same goes for the other admins and mods as well, I'm sure.

Anything else? :)
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Sara
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Sara » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:11 pm

Yeah, it bothers me. Because everyone can try and tag before uploading on phone, yet you can't. And the reason you gave for not tagging is ridiculous.
Ran wrote:can't help but feel that you have some other issues going on
I do have many more issues board related, yes, but I didn't bring them up because they are not related to this topic, so nice try. Not to mention that you did attack me once and got away with it because of 'personal issues', so not very good argument to use against me. Anything else? :)

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Fhant
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Fhant » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:20 pm

Allow me to speak for myself as a mod, I always check the uploaded image and then, if not tagged, wait 5 to 10 minutes. If no change has happened, I will request to tag the image.
I do believe that the tagging on mobile is horrible (I, myself have never tried it) and I can understand the simple option of "Just use the website on a PC/Laptop" isn't a valid one for a lot of people.

So I am going to say it here for users and mods to see, I do believe we need to be lenient on the rule but keep it unwritten.
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Ran
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Ran » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:21 pm

I'm not sure what to say if someone "violating" a regulation that you mistakenly assumed was something it's not bothers you. I still actively and accurately tag my images immediately. Simply because I don't adhere to your specific desire does not mean I am violating rules.

Also, I remember when I lashed out at you a while back. I also apologized for said action. Not much else to be done there on my part if you can't get past it. Maybe you should take a break for a while, Sara.
Fhant wrote:Allow me to speak for myself as a mod, I always check the uploaded image and then, if not tagged, wait 5 to 10 minutes. If no change has happened, I will request to tag the image.
Same. I even had one of my images go for a few minutes without tags because my Chrome crashed. Aizawa caught it and I tagged it as soon as I got back on. I expect the same from anyone.
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Sara
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Sara » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:35 pm

Ran wrote:Simply because I don't adhere to your specific desire does not mean I am violating rules.
Given that the users who replied to me have the same problem with your tagging, this is not only my desire anymore. Sure, I'm way more harsh, direct and open about it than other users, but the point is all the same. It's a fact.
Ran wrote:Maybe you should take a break for a while, Sara.
Yeah, perhaps this is the perfect solution. No sarcasm.

You know, my point wasn't that I can't get past it, because I did. My point is that you shouldn't call me out on 'having issues' (that I don't have), yet use personal issues as an excuse that time. Not discussing are they true or not, that's not my intention.
Fhant wrote:So I am going to say it here for users and mods to see, I do believe we need to be lenient on the rule but keep it unwritten.
Worst solution to be honest, and it's something I'll never agree with, be it final decision or not.

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Gally
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Gally » Sun Jan 28, 2018 3:56 pm

Ran wrote:Specifically: Users are expected to tag their images when uploading or within a couple minutes.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I haven't seen anyone else do this so often, and if by some chance someone accidentally uploads before tagging, they're usually told to tag before uploading, not after. And yet there seems to be one exception.
Fhant wrote:So I am going to say it here for users and mods to see, I do believe we need to be lenient on the rule but keep it unwritten.
Oh gosh, I can see how this could get out of hand pretty fast. And anyway, this is kinda like suggesting to bend the rules all of a sudden, but I don't see how that could solve anything instead of just creating more problems.
Ran wrote:I even had one of my images go for a few minutes without tags because my Chrome crashed. Aizawa caught it and I tagged it as soon as I got back on. I expect the same from anyone.
Chrome crashing is one thing, and technical issues are not what we were talking about. Still, if tags were added before uploading, even that wouldn't have happened.

So what I got from these replies is that the rule was never really a rule and only some people sometimes get told off about the issue. Okay - none of that makes sense.

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Ran
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Ran » Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:02 pm

Sara wrote:Given that the users who replied to me have the same problem with your tagging, this is not only my desire anymore. Sure, I'm way more harsh, direct and open about it than other users, but the point is all the same. It's a fact.
Yes, but those problems all stem from the same false understanding of the rules which I posted above. The rules do not require images be tagged prior to uploading, but rather to be tagged properly in an immediate fashion. As Rabbit even said she thought was a good idea!
RockRabbit wrote:i think it would be fair to either change the rule so everyone has the ability to tag their image after uploading for at least 5-10 minutes, without getting chewed on, or penalize everyone for it, mods and taggers included.
It IS the actual rule! It wasnt changed!

We should hold all members accountable on the same level. Even the example you gave above had a two minute discrepency (1:52 - 1:54) between the image being uploaded and the user being called out on it.
Sara wrote:Another beautiful example of how fair our moderators are:
http://e-shuushuu.net/image/700306/
That's actually a fair and timely approach.
Sara wrote:Yeah, perhaps this is the perfect solution. No sarcasm.

You know, my point wasn't that I can't get past it, because I did. My point is that you shouldn't call me out on 'having issues' (that I don't have), yet use personal issues as an excuse that time. Not discussing are they true or not, that's not my intention.
My point wasn't to call you out per say, but rather to say that maybe there's more to this outburst. As you said before, we have a handful of disagreements. That's all fine, but we can keep it on a civil level. I'm not trying to run you off, don't get the wrong idea, but maybe a short breather would be good.
Gally wrote:So what I got from these replies is that the rule was never really a rule and only some people sometimes get told off about the issue. Okay - none of that makes sense.
Essentially this. Posters shouldn't be reported or chastised if they don't tag their images before uploading. However, letting images go on for minutes without tags is frowned upon and should be addressed. That's why tagging prior to uploading is preferred. A refresher for some of the moderators may be in order, but the rule is actually as stated.
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Sara
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Sara » Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:10 pm

I think that you should give it a break too, and I'm serious. Anyway, not to write another wall of text, let me try to be short:
I agree with Gally. This is just like the ecchi images case. It's easy to run away from problem by avoiding the said problem, by making the rules even more lenient if that's possible or by locking the thread, which I'm sure will happen. Just because RockRabbit's solution fits your criteria, it doesn't mean it fits mine. I think that my opinion should be valued just the same as yours, and my solution is simple - tag images before uploading.

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Ran
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Ran » Sun Jan 28, 2018 4:53 pm

It certainly wouldn't be the first time I've taken a break. :lol:

Nobody is running from an issue or locking a thread even if it did start a little heated. As of this writing, no violation of the rules has taken place. A misunderstanding of them by members and false projection of them by staff perhaps, but little else.

Regarding the feedback in this thread, I've no qualms with bringing some attention to the rule with the other staff members. If we can reach a reasonable consensus, then a more stringent revision of the rule may be written.

Let's just try to be a bit more diplomatic in these instances for the future. :)
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Sara
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Re: Getting away with tagging AFTER posting

Post by Sara » Mon Jan 29, 2018 4:09 am

I think I've said this in some of my other posts in this thread, but I think it's worth repeating over and over: tag then upload is one of the better rules we have, and the fact 99% of our users are following it should mean something. Good catch on traditions page, but I still can discuss how good for site those traditions are.
And even if your solution to this is final, which I hope won't happen, what's the time limit for tagging an image after uploading? I think that 5-10 minutes is too much and very unfair to users who tag before posting.
I can see the unwritten rule 'tag after posting' being very abused, and I can only agree with it if it's for technical issues.

On the other hand, I've seen countless of comments like this 'tag before uploading'. Users who tag before uploading are majority, and users who tag after are minority and they are usually warned when they do it. Rules on this site changed, are changing and will continue to change and I'm fine with that. Changing the rule from tag before posting or in couple of minutes into tag before posting is an awesome change. :)

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